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Posts Tagged ‘ideas’

Don’t get me wrong I really like these books and the world is a much better place with people like Dawkins and Hitchens in it. The attack on religion is an important one; it challenges yet again the position of religion and the role that it should take in our societies. It enables non-believers a position to argue against and reject those that force religion upon them. They also offer a method of causing a debate with your friends. Still they only attack religion and never God, if we assume that God is different to that presented by religion. There are two problems with these books, the first is that the books are only written for those that are against or are not sure about religion in the first place. While watching many religious people attack the likes of Dawkins (et al) it’s clear that the debate will never be won. Yes they produce awareness and they are interesting but I don’t see the removal of the Pope in the near future or the end of religious violence through the acceptance of the atheists’ model. It just does not work like that, people will not abandon religion through the attack of faith it’s more likely they will become disillusioned with religious false promises. It is then the atheist’s gang that will get a new member! I will write more about the abandonment of religion in the near future so I will not go into depth here. It is difficult to see the progress that Dawkins and Hitchens make in their attack although this might be different across countries. They should attack religion but not religious people there is no point, there is a point however in making sure that religion is different from government as much as we can, this should be our right which we all need to fight for. By religious people I mean your friends or people you meet, this does not include those that make public comments or talk about their religion as they are in public view and demand to be answered.

*http://richarddawkins.net

There was a video clip I watched, I have forgotten the name of the author, it made the impression that it was pointless entering into a discussion. In other words there is as much point in arguing about the rights & wrongs of religion with a religious person as there is trying to teach string theory to a really f**king stupid monkey. You will never get anywhere, this does not mean I think religious people are stupid (well everyone can be stupid at times), it just means at some point you are just wasting your energy. Where does that leave us non-believers? There still needs to be challenges to religion, however this is not a new thing and it’s been happening for longer than you think. If it was not challenged then it would destroy everything and I mean that, it would crash into our lives and everyone should be angry about that. It is also right that Hitchens should name and shame religious practices that are wrong, if it keeps happening maybe they will change or maybe everyone else will start to look down on religion and that would be a good thing. Other than fun the new atheists’ books might help atheists plus the general group of semi-believers, this is a useful and good step. I don’t really think it should ever be addressed at religious people though. I would also suggest that you must keep the good name of atheists, although I disagree with that term, answer religious people with thought and consideration.

The second error: Melvin Konner illustrates an impressive analogy, although he suggests it is a poor one but I think it explains a lot. To paraphrase it; the books of the new atheists are very much like writing a book about water. You could have chapters on floods, tornados, hurricanes and you could also state that most of the water on the earth has salt in it thus making it poisonous to humans. From this you would conclude that water does more harm than good, since all you have read is about the harm water does rather than the good things it can do. Much like the new atheists books, there is a focus of harm and that would of course make you angry about the ideas that have been presented. There is no balance, Konner suggests, to the approach that has been taken and this is the case when reading some of Dawkin’s work on evolution and how it is being attacked by Christian America. It would worry me more if that this was the standard Christian approach to evolution, although the Pope, who in my book is not a man of pure good, finds that evolution is not in conflict with Christianity. This is perhaps the error of new atheists, to simply assume that religion is just a force for evil and even though it can be that never should mean we should focus only on that aspect. There has been a very strong reaction towards these books, strong is good but sometimes its also important to remember that balance is important. I am also guilty on no balance, but being an atheist & hopefully a rational person I will also listen to the other side of the argument when it is shown. So should you! An argument is different from the ‘I am right, you are wrong’ approach.

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Ok first listen to this guy about how the Koran is wrong and that the bible is a more dependable source for historical accuracy. There are a few interesting things that I will highlight from what he is saying and then we can discuss why he is wrong, I will put his statements in blue they are not quotes just me summarising what was said. Before I go on I don’t know who this man is because the person that posted the video to youtube did not post his name and comments were not allowed. At the end he says however, that even if he was not a Christian he would still say these things – No, he has an agenda of his own faith that means that everything he think about in this area goes through the coloured glass of Christianity. Second, the audience, which seems to support him on these matters, also means that he is more likely to gain from insulting Islam and reinforcing Christian beliefs & values. So these things are based not on any kind of truth, rather on his own religious belief producing his own truth.

The Koran is not an accurate document – Really? Neither is the bible, it has been rewritten so many times which has resulted in it being more of a political document than an historical one. It also does not follow any evidence, according to the bible dinosaurs were created only 6,000 to 10,000 years ago despite at least 12 independent tests of dinosaur remains putting them living at least 65 years ago going up to 230 million years ago. Oh and now a museum in Kentucky USA based on the creationist perspective cites that dinosaurs were taken on Noah’s Ark. What is it called when someone makes statements about something things even though there is no mention in any historical artefact? Oh right, it’s called a guess.

Jesus was born talking Islamic scripture – This has to be the best statement ever! Oh of course the point here was that Muslims were making it up so that the “truth” would meet their own ends. This is so less believable then Jesus being immaculacy conceived which was just something the Roman Catholic Church made up in order to portray Jesus being born without sin. In fact those Christians that don’t believe Jesus being immaculacy conceived describe it as Jesus being the result miraculously Conception. And I know that Catholics will argue that the virgin birth and Immaculate Conception are different things, they mean the same thing in most people’s head but just to make sure Mary the mother of Jesus had a one way vagina which is a lovely expression Christopher Hitchens used. Any real proof that this happened Christians? *cough*

His second misgiving of Islam is that it is an historical inaccurate conception of Jesus – I don’t want to sound like a broken record but how they hell does he know that? Ok he also said that either the New Testament or the Koran is wrong and it’s more likely that the New Testament is right because it was basically written closer to the time the events are supposed to have happened. Bart Ehrman points out the mistakes in the New Testament resulting just from monks making mistakes in copying out new bibles. There is evidence for this and that these mistakes once made where recopied and the original meaning changing over time due to errors being recopying again and again. You want to talk about historical accurate documents, let’s start there.

My point is that twats like this man that comment on other religions when they don’t even care about looking at their own religious belief are not only inexperienced at thinking, they are also stupid. I admit I make comments about religion but I am not promoting one particular faith neither am I suggesting that somehow the floors in my belief systems are unimportant. The general point of this post – Don’t throw stones in glass houses. How is his statements anymore than a promotion of his own beliefs.

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